With 57% of Google searches now ending without a click, where are those potential customers going? Matthew Stafford from Build Grow Scale reveals why LLM traffic converts at 5X the rate of traditional search—and how smaller brands can capture this opportunity before the giants catch on.

Matthew Stafford has spent a decade helping eCommerce brands scale, working with companies doing £200,000 to £3 million monthly. Across every US-based client, he's seen organic traffic drop 20-30% this year. But the brands optimising for LLMs aren't just recovering that lost traffic—they're converting it at rates that make their old Google numbers look pedestrian. We explore why AI assistants have become trusted advisors rather than search tools, the specific tactics working right now (including buyer-intent FAQs per product), and why Matthew calls this the biggest shift he's seen in his entire consulting career.

Key Point Timestamps:

06:08 - The 57% no-click problem and LLM shift

12:12 - AI as trusted advisor

22:56 - Buyer-intent FAQs explained

27:40 - Schema markup for LLMs

36:41 - Why small brands have the advantage

Google was always about accessing information. You typed in a query, got a list of links, and did the research yourself. LLMs work completely differently—they've become trusted advisors that people share everything with.

"People literally are using these LLMs for their therapist and sharing everything with them," Matthew explains. "And then they're now going there to make their buying decision."

When a trusted advisor recommends something, people buy. That's why LLM referrals convert at 5X the rate of Google traffic. The LLM knows customer preferences, behaviours, and context. It's not just matching keywords anymore—it's making personalised recommendations.

Most websites have FAQ sections that aren't actually answering frequently asked questions—they're thinly veiled sales pitches. Matthew challenges brands to rethink this entirely.

"My question to them is, why would shipping time be on your FAQ? And they go, well, people ask that all the time. And I said, then that means that you're too lazy to put it on your website."

Real FAQ optimisation for LLMs means creating questions that demonstrate buyer intent—questions someone would only ask if they were seriously considering a purchase. The key insight: do this per product, not just site-wide. Start with your top 20% of products that drive 80% of sales.

What makes this opportunity so compelling for smaller brands is the asymmetric potential. Matthew describes it as finding "the little hinges that swing the big doors."

"I truly believe that for the little guys, this is a level playing field. The only thing that is going to allow the bigger ones to outspend you maybe is if they take action sooner. But what I've found is these big companies that we deal with, they know that they need to do it, but they don't do it because they don't know what to do."

Large organisations move slowly. By the time they've figured out their LLM strategy, smaller brands could have six months of consistent optimisation under their belts. Matthew compares it to the early Google days of 2004—a spiralling upward effect for those who act first.

Today's guest: Matthew Stafford

Company: Build Grow Scale

Website: buildgrowscale.com

Email: matt@buildgrowscale.com

What if your e-commerce platform is actually holding you back? Mikel Lindsaar, founder of StoreConnect and author of the forthcoming book Customer Commerce, explains why most platforms end up controlling your business rather than serving it. We explore how unified data systems enable smarter automation, faster page loads, and the kind of personalised customer experiences that build lifetime value.

Mikel shares practical examples including a museum using AI to identify VIP visitors, automated refunds that create customer delight, and how one company consolidated 76 websites across 26 brands onto a single platform. We also discuss why his strongest advice has nothing to do with technology: put a phone number on your website and actually answer it.

Key Point Timestamps:

09:23 - The Tail Wagging the Dog Problem

15:21 - AI for Customer Identification

22:04 - The Real Cost of Platform Fragmentation

26:41 - Creating Moments of Joy

39:34 - Why Phone Support Still Matters

Mikel had three clients approach him in a single year asking to build e-commerce platforms that integrate with Salesforce. His initial reaction was to redirect them to Shopify or BigCommerce. Their response changed his thinking entirely.

"Those platforms are all fantastic for the front end," Mikel explains. "They do an incredible job at helping someone buy a widget. What they all genuinely suck at is if I want to access the data in my way, or I want to build automations the way I want to build those automations."

The result is what Mikel calls "the tail wagging the dog" - your e-commerce platform dictates how you access data, how you report, how you contact customers, and how the checkout flow works. Instead of your business processes driving the technology, the technology drives your business.

As e-commerce businesses grow, they accumulate SaaS tools. Shopify, then Klaviyo, then reviews, then loyalty, then subscriptions. Before long, you've got 20 different products running your business.

"You now have your data in Shopify, in Klaviyo, and maybe six or seven plugins on random Amazon servers around the world," Mikel points out. "That data is becoming a bit of a challenge from a security point of view."

Each plugin charges monthly, holds a piece of your customer data, and potentially slows down your site. The clever automations that actually transform customer relationships become nearly impossible to build when your data is fragmented across dozens of systems.

When your data lives in one place, you can start treating customers as humans rather than transactions. Mikel shares a common scenario: you buy something, then days later receive an email offering 10% off the thing you just bought.

Now flip it. A customer buys something 24 hours before a 10% sale launches. Instead of sending them the promotional email, your system automatically refunds 10% to their credit card and explains what you've done.

"If I got an email like that, I'd be like, are you kidding?" Mikel says. "These moments of joy, treat them as humans. Don't treat them as just a transaction."

Mikel suggests using AI for pre-processing rather than real-time calculation. An education provider using StoreConnect runs algorithms when a student completes a course, determining the next best course based on their entire history. By the time the congratulations email goes out, it already contains a personalised recommendation.

"Instead of having to send them to a site which is trying to calculate the next best course for that student, you've already done all that work in the back end," Mikel explains. "That page loads within a tenth of a second or less."

The key is...

With over 10,000 3PLs in the US alone, how do you avoid choosing one that sinks your business? Dave Gulas from EZDC 3PL shares the horror stories he's witnessed and the questions that separate good logistics partners from disasters waiting to happen.

In this episode, we explore why treating logistics as a commodity leads to problems, how to vet a fulfilment partner properly, and the operational details that matter when you're shipping thousands of orders monthly. Dave's background in the pharmaceutical industry, where urgency is non-negotiable, shaped his approach to e-commerce fulfilment. He shares what he looks for in great clients (spoiler: they ask the most questions) and why his sales cycle runs several months by design.

Key Point Timestamps:

07:06 - What EZDC 3PL does and who they serve

08:57 - When outsourcing fulfilment makes sense

22:45 - Why treating logistics as a commodity fails

27:43 - Horror stories from bad 3PL partnerships

32:37 - The technology stack that matters

40:59 - Warehouse layout for efficiency

48:20 - The questions to ask before choosing

Dave doesn't respond to enquiries that simply ask "what's your pricing?" without context. His reasoning is straightforward.

"It truly is a partnership. When you get into a business partnership with somebody, are you just going to look someone up online, ask a couple of questions and sign the contract? I hope not."

The brands that treat logistics as a commodity, shopping purely on price, often end up with the problems Dave sees repeatedly. His sales cycle runs several months because both sides need to establish clear expectations before committing.

Dave has heard them all. Warehouses going bust without telling clients. Inventory tracked on spreadsheets. Response times measured in days.

"We've heard all the horror stories you can think of from literally the warehouse going out of business because they defaulted on their lease and not telling the brand and basically stealing inventory."

These aren't edge cases. When they happen, it's "a big hole to dig out of." Sometimes businesses don't recover.

Dave uses ShipHero as his warehouse management system. But the specific system matters less than having a proper one at all.

"I'm shocked at how many actual 3PLs are out there where they're tracking inventory on spreadsheets and they're doing things manually. I have brands talk to me like, can you connect to our Shopify? Is that possible? They don't even realise that's possible because they're coming from a warehouse that doesn't do that."

If a potential partner mentions spreadsheets, that's your cue to walk away.

Dave's best advice is simple: ask more questions. The best long-term relationships start with the most questions on the front end.

"The best clients, the best long-term relationships are the ones that ask the most questions on the front end. So we're happy to answer them. You can't ask too many."

Ask about their technology stack. Ask for references. Do a site visit if possible. The goal isn't to catch them out. It's to establish clear expectations before you commit.

Today's guest: Dave Gulas

Company: EZDC 3PL

Website: ezdc3pl.com

LinkedIn: Connect with Dave on LinkedIn

Companies that capture and apply lessons have a 27% higher success rate. Yet most eCommerce founders either skip their year-end review entirely or give their numbers a cursory glance. In this Slingshot episode, Matt Edmundson shares the framework that saved LEGO from bankruptcy and reveals why accountability partners increase goal achievement by 95%.

Matt opens with the remarkable story of LEGO's near-collapse in 2003, when the company discovered it hadn't generated economic profit for over a decade. Through confronting brutal facts with honest review, they transformed into one of the world's most successful brands. We explore the common traps founders fall into during reviews, including the dangerous 'genius trap' when things go well. Matt introduces the Slingshot framework covering seven essential business areas, explains the critical difference between lead and lag measures, and shares the specific financial and customer metrics worth tracking. The episode closes with compelling research on why doing reviews alone limits your potential.

Key Point Timestamps:

00:18 - The Importance of Year-End Reviews

01:16 - How LEGO Saved Themselves from Bankruptcy

04:49 - Common Review Pitfalls and the Genius Trap

14:00 - The 7 Areas of the Slingshot Framework

22:00 - Lead Measures vs Lag Measures

27:00 - The Numbers Worth Tracking

33:53 - The Power of Accountability Partners

In 2003, LEGO was on the brink of bankruptcy with sales down 30% and $800 million in debt. This was a company that hadn't made a loss between 1932 and 1998. When leadership finally conducted a thorough review, they discovered the company hadn't generated any economic profit for more than ten years.

"They didn't know which products actually made money. They didn't know their customers anymore," Matt explains. "As one executive put it, the culture was so closed off that massive opportunities were completely invisible."

The result of confronting these brutal facts? Nearly 20% compound growth over two decades. By 2020, they'd launched an entire 18+ product line for the adult customers they'd previously ignored.

Matt introduces a subtle trap that catches founders when things actually go well. When the facts aren't brutal, it's dangerously easy to cherry-pick wins and build narratives that feel good but teach nothing.

"The goal isn't to prove you're brilliant. It's to understand what actually worked, what didn't, and where to focus next," Matt emphasises. "Imagine presenting your findings to a board of directors. What would you proudly share? And what would you rather not mention? That second list is where the real insights live."

This isn't ego management. It's pattern recognition that drives genuine improvement.

After years of building and selling eCommerce businesses, Matt shares the seven interconnected areas that meaningful reviews need to cover:

1. Sell (Product) — Which products are your real winners versus quietly draining resources?

2. Story (Brand) — Do you truly understand who you're serving and is your messaging landing?

3. Tech Stack — Is your technology helping or hindering? Are systems integrated or fragmented?

4. Marketing — If your main marketing channel disappeared tomorrow, would your business survive?

5. Optimise (Conversion) — When did you last watch a real customer try to use your site?

6. Experience (Post-Purchase) — Is your post-purchase journey building loyalty or losing customers?

7. Growth — Which growth lever has the most room to...

What does the Nativity story have to do with running an eCommerce business? In this special Christmas Day message, Matt Edmundson draws some beautifully tenuous parallels between shepherds, mangers, and Joseph, and the journey of every Digital David building something meaningful.

This isn't a typical episode with frameworks and downloads. It's a cup of tea and a heartfelt thank you. Matt reflects on the meaning of Advent (the arrival of something wonderful) and finds unexpected connections between the Christmas story and the eCommerce journey. From early customers who become unlikely evangelists, to bootstrap operations that are sufficient for their purpose, to the quiet faithfulness of just doing the work without needing the spotlight.

Key Point Timestamps:

00:00 - Introduction

02:25 - The Magic of Advent

04:47 - The Shepherds (Your First Evangelists)

06:59 - The Manger (Your Bootstrap Operation)

09:11 - Joseph (Quiet Faithful Execution)

11:32 - A Thank You to Digital Davids

The shepherds weren't the target demographic for announcing a royal birth. They were society's undesirables. Yet they became the first evangelists, so moved by what they saw that they couldn't stop telling everyone.

Your early customers might be similar. They're not the fancy influencers with high follower counts. They're the ones who discovered you before you were polished, before the fancy branding and proper email sequences. They found something genuine and couldn't stop talking about it.

Matt shares a story from Jersey (his old beauty company) about a lady who wrote blogs from another country, bringing in tens of thousands of pounds in sales monthly. These early adopters spread your story in a way no marketing budget could ever buy.

Jesus was laid in a feeding trough. Not exactly the expected birthplace for a king. Yet the wise men still brought their finest gifts, recognising true worth beyond humble circumstances.

Your eCommerce business might not look as impressive as your well-funded competitors'. Your tech stack might be held together with hope and Zapier. Your warehouse might be your garage. But excellence isn't about having the fanciest infrastructure. It's about faithfully serving your mission with whatever resources you have.

The manger was sufficient for its purpose. It held the baby. So is your scrappy, bootstrap operation.

Joseph barely gets any lines in the school play. Almost no dialogue in the Bible. But watch what he does. He takes Mary as his wife when it would have been easier not to. He travels to Bethlehem. He flees to Egypt. He returns when told it's safe. Each decision required faith and immediate action. No fanfare, no recognition.

"Execution trumps intention every single time," Matt emphasises. You can have brilliant strategies, beautiful brand guidelines, and ambitious growth plans. But without disciplined follow-through, your business stalls.

Joseph models something we can all learn from. A man of quiet faithfulness, just doing the work without needing the spotlight.

Episode link: https://www.ecommerce-podcast.com/christmas-thankyou

Most eCommerce brands settle for pop-up opt-in rates of 3-5% whilst competitors achieve 10-15%. Shaan Arora, CEO of Alia Popups, reveals the systematic testing approach used by 3,000 brands including Peloton and Nike to dramatically improve email collection without destroying margins.

We explore why copy matters more than design, how mystery discounts outperform fixed offers, the difference between mobile and desktop timing, and why holdout tests prove pop-ups increase both conversion rates and AOV despite the annoyance factor. Shaan shares data-driven insights from 100 million monthly pop-up views.

Key Point Timestamps:

02:17 - The biggest pop-up problem brands face

04:55 - Mystery discount strategy that increases opt-ins

08:08 - Alternative offers beyond discounts

18:59 - Testing discount percentages systematically

24:17 - What's a good opt-in rate?

26:42 - Segmentation and personalisation

28:36 - Are pop-ups worth the annoyance?

37:06 - Copy, timing, and design priority order

46:23 - Building a personal brand as founder

One of the easiest wins comes from a simple copy change that doesn't touch your margins at all. Instead of revealing your 10% discount upfront with "Get 10% Off Your First Order", try copy like "Unlock Your Mystery Discount" or "Claim the Discount You've Earned."

"A lot of brands believe that in order to get a really good opt-in rate, you need to give a pretty crazy offer," Shaan explains. "We've seen brands that have early access pop-ups without even an offer that gets to about 10% opt-in rates."

Same 10% discount. Different psychology. Brands see large increases in opt-ins without changing the actual offer because humans can't resist finding out what they've "earned." The curiosity gap works.

Before assuming you need to offer 20% or 30% off to achieve decent opt-in rates, test. Shaan urges brands to test 20% against 15%, or 15% against 10%. Track not just opt-in rates but also conversion rate, bounce rate, AOV, and revenue from codes.

"We've had brands that have done 20%, gone down to 15% and pretty much had the same results for opt-in rates," Shaan shares. That's a 5% margin improvement without losing performance.

The data shows that when cashback is tested against discount, discount wins but sometimes only by 30% - not such a huge percentage that it's definitively worth the margin hit.

Most brands obsess over design first, which is the wrong priority. Shaan's data from 3,000 brands reveals a clear hierarchy.

"Copy is number one by far and away the most important thing to test," Shaan emphasises. "What copy can resonate well. Like 'You've got 15% off,' 'You've earned 15% off,' 'Here's 15% off,' 'Here's a mystery discount.' All of these things are the biggest thing to move it."

Timing comes second - when exactly the pop-up appears matters, especially across mobile versus desktop. Design lands third, including what creative to show and whether to show creative at all.

Shaan's team makes it extremely easy to run holdout tests: pop-up versus no pop-up, measuring conversion rate and average order value. The results are clear.

"Across the board, on pretty much every single test we've run with this, we see CVR and AOV go up when you have a pop-up versus when you don't have a pop-up," Shaan reveals.

Even people who immediately close the pop-up benefit from knowing a discount exists. They're aware that when they're ready to check out, a code is waiting for them somewhere, and just knowing that increases purchase likelihood.

Today's guest: Shaan...

Most eCommerce stores with large product catalogues share a common problem that quietly kills growth. It's not their products, pricing, or marketing budget—it's their site structure. Sam Wright, founder of Blink SEO and creator of Macalytics, reveals why taxonomy is the biggest drag on growth for stores doing £3-5 million annually, and exactly how to fix it using Search Console data.

We explore why collection pages represent 35% of all search impressions (more than products and blogs combined), how to determine the right level of granularity for your categorisation, and why most stores aren't deep enough with their subcategories. Sam shares his framework for using Search Console impression data to identify exactly where to create new collection pages, and explains the critical difference between what works for user experience versus what search engines can actually index.

Key Point Timestamps:

06:30 - The Large Catalogue Challenge

11:45 - Why Collection Pages Are Your Biggest SEO Opportunity

16:20 - The Granularity Problem Most Stores Face

22:15 - Using Search Console Data to Guide Taxonomy

27:40 - Real-World Example: Redesigning for Better Structure

35:10 - Future-Proofing for AI Search with Persona Data

42:30 - The AI Shortcut and Critical Warning

Sam defines large catalogue stores as those where the buying journey tips into a different mode—one based around comparison and filtering rather than simple browsing. This typically happens around 250 products, though it varies by category.

"With large catalogue stores, the buying journey is based around comparison and filtering," Sam explains. "A lot of the time these stores have grown up organically over a period of time and no one's taken ownership about how the store's organised."

This organic growth creates a drag on everything—SEO, user experience, conversion rates, even email segmentation. Stores reach £3-5 million in annual revenue, so things are fundamentally working. But growth isn't happening as fast as it should because nobody stepped back to think strategically about organisation and purpose.

Sam shared compelling data from across all the Shopify stores his agency works with: "It's about 35% of all impressions come on collections, which is much more than products and blogs. It's basically the entry point for most people when they're doing actual new product discovery."

More than a third of search visibility comes from collection pages—the pages where new customers first encounter the store. Yet most stores aren't categorised in a way that aligns with how people actually search for their products.

This represents a massive untapped opportunity. If collection pages are already driving 35% of impressions without optimisation, imagine the potential when they're properly structured and aligned with search behaviour.

The real opportunity for most stores lies in going deeper with categorisation. Much deeper.

"Most people are not granular enough with their categorisation," Sam emphasises. "A lot of stores will just have a t-shirts category. They won't subcategorise those t-shirts to the level that matches how people are actually searching."

Sam uses sofas as an example: "So sofas as the parent category, like blue sofas, blue four seat sofas, blue four seat corduroy sofas. That filtering process, that is how people do search."

The challenge on Shopify is that these filters aren't indexable for search engines. Google ads can't effectively target filters either. The solution is breaking out popular subcategories into actual collection pages.

"The real opportunity for a lot of stores is how deep you go in that categorisation because you've got products that other people...

What if one video per week could generate referral-quality leads for your eCommerce business? Nate Woodbury reveals how to leverage YouTube's search algorithm instead of chasing viral views, creating educational content that brings dream customers directly to you.

We explore how eCommerce businesses can generate consistent, high-quality leads through strategic YouTube content. Nate Woodbury, who has produced over 60 YouTube channels, shares his Leaf Strategy—focusing on answering specific 8+ word questions with low search volume (as few as 10 searches per month) to build authority systematically. Rather than competing for viral views, this approach prioritises educational content that ranks quickly on YouTube and Google, attracting customers who are actively searching for solutions.

We discuss why 10-12 minute videos create the optimal trust-building window, how to research golden questions using keyword tools, and why wrong audience growth from viral videos can actually damage your channel. Nate reveals his testing results showing YouTube Shorts only drove 0.1% increase in long-form views, and shares the entrance point strategy that guides viewers from YouTube to your email list without feeling sold to.

Key Point Timestamps:

05:11 - Entertainment vs Educational YouTube Strategy

12:17 - The Leaf Strategy: Starting with Low Search Volume

13:41 - Finding Questions with 8+ Words

28:02 - The 10-12 Minute Sweet Spot

36:20 - The Entrance Point Strategy

40:22 - YouTube Shorts Testing Results

42:23 - When Viral Videos Hurt Your Channel

Nate distinguishes between two fundamentally different approaches to YouTube. Most advice focuses on entertainment—creating content that appeals to the broadest audience to generate ad revenue through viral views. But there's a completely different algorithm at play for businesses.

"There's multiple algorithms on YouTube," Nate explains. "Most of the advice we hear is geared towards having our videos go viral so we can get as many views as possible. But we can actually focus instead on search."

This distinction changes everything. Entertainment content interrupts people and requires breaking through resistance. Educational content serves people who are actively seeking answers, meeting them exactly where they are. For eCommerce businesses with educational components—supplements, complex products, or anything requiring customer education—this search-focused strategy generates referral-quality leads rather than just views.

Nate uses a tree analogy to explain his approach. The trunk represents broad topics like "nutrition." Branches are categories like "nutrition for weight loss." And leaves are the specific questions people type into search engines.

Most businesses chase the trunk and big branches—terms with thousands of monthly searches and massive competition. Nate's approach flips this entirely: start with questions that only get 10 searches per month.

"I consider that gold," Nate shares. "That's probably going to turn into lead generation every single month, even if there's just 10 searches a month."

The beauty is speed and certainty. With minimal competition for highly specific questions, videos rank at the top of YouTube and Google within a day or two. As you dominate more specific questions on a particular branch, the algorithms recognise your authority on that entire topic, eventually allowing you to rank for bigger terms—but you've built authority from the ground up.

The key to this strategy is finding the right questions. Nate recommends Semrush's Keyword Magic Tool (with a free trial at herokeywordtool.com), but uses it differently than traditional SEO.

Rather than looking for...