In a working world where the conversation is increasingly dominated by AI, we need to consciously prioritise human connection and old-school practices, like face-to-face conversations, physical books, and time for deep thinking, to avoid becoming trapped in a cycle of constant acceleration that ultimately undermines our wellbeing and what makes us fundamentally human.

Jon Whittle is the former CEO of CSIRO's Data61, Australia's national AI research and development centre. He led a team of around 500 scientists, engineers and support staff across Australia. Jon’s working is transitioning to helping organisations understand and adopt AI in an effective, human-centred way, particularly with boards and leadership teams.

Three reasons to listen

• To reframe AI adoption around human needs rather than pure efficiency
• To discover the risks of outsourcing human connection to AI
• Ao learn how to adopt old-school practices that preserve your humanity

Episode highlights

• [00:10:24] Leading hundreds of scientists and engineers
• [00:13:14] What it means to be human in an AI world
• [00:23:25] The danger of sharing problems with AI rather than other humans
• [00:31:33] What Jon has learned from classical Indian dance
• [00:36:18] AI for Business
• [00:39:55] Jon's media recommendation
• [00:42:06] Takeaways from Pia and Dan

Links

• Connect with Jon via LinkedIn
• AI for Business – Jon’s book
• CSIRO presents: Everyday AI – Jon’s podcast
• Turning Down the Noise – Jon’s media recommendation
• Track and improve your team performance with Squadify
• Leave us a voice note

Leading through uncertainty means accepting complexity rather than fighting it. The most powerful tool for doing so is clarity.

While conventional wisdom suggests focusing on trust-building and communication skills, Squadify data shows that starting with clarity – specifically around shared goals, processes, and measures of success – is what actually transforms groups of individuals into cohesive teams and drives performance.

Three reasons to listen

• Learn to befriend uncertainty and focus on what you can influence
• Discover how to build team cohesion through clarity rather than trust exercises
• Understand how teams work together as the key performance driver

Episode highlights

• [00:02:31] Jamie's question
• [00:03:36] Befriending uncertainty
• [00:05:38] Are you a team, or a TINO?
• [00:08:51] The sixth dysfunction in teams
• [00:11:12] The trigger question for high performance
• [00:13:42] Doubling down on humanity
• [00:16:41] Coming up in 2026

Links

• Track and improve your team performance with Squadify
• Leave us a voice note

Autonomy in teams requires clarity, not chaos. Successful autonomous teams need defined authority over coordination, transparent processes, and intentional facilitation to empower people whilst maintaining alignment and effectiveness.

Jon Barnes is a facilitator, coach, and co-founder of Pala, and he focuses on helping teams and organisations become more autonomous. His approach spans a spectrum from making hierarchies feel less hierarchical, to helping teams operate fundamentally without line management.

Three reasons to listen

• Create clarity in team structures by defining authority and decision-making processes upfront
• Build psychological safety and engagement through effective facilitation techniques
• Balance empowerment with appropriate holding by learning when to let go and when to provide direction

Episode highlights

• [00:12:22] the two types of waste in teams
• [00:18:10] What does leadership look like away from hierarchy?
• [00:21:44] Self-management in highly-pressurised teams
• [00:25:37] The myth of self-governance
• [00:27:12] Unhelpful self-management patterns
• [00:32:47] Jon's biggest two levers
• [00:35:32] Jon's media recommendation
• [00:36:59] Dan's media recommendation
• [00:41:12] Takeaways from Pia and Dan

Links

• Connect with Jon via LinkedIn
• Humankind, by Rutger Bregman
• Lonesome Dove, by Larry McMurtry – Jon’s media recommendation
• The Ministry of Time, by Kaliane Bradley – Dan’s media recommendation
• From the Core, by John Wineland – Pia’s media recommendation
• Track and improve your team performance with Squadify
• Leave us a voice note