What does it really take to lead at the very top, and how do you stay true to yourself when the responsibility keeps growing?

In this episode of Leading 4 Life "Stories", I'm joined by Malcolm Gomersall, CEO of Grant Thornton UK, for a fascinating and refreshingly candid conversation about leadership, personal growth, transformation and creating opportunities for others.

Malcolm's journey from being the first in his family to attend university to leading one of the UK's major professional services firms has been anything but straightforward. He talks openly about his early struggles, the setbacks that shaped his career and the moment he realised that trying to be somebody else simply wasn't working.

We explore the realities of becoming CEO, the importance of trusting and empowering people, and the challenges of leading significant organisational change. Malcolm also shares his perspective on external investment, AI, the changing world of professional services and the importance of developing future talent.

Perhaps most importantly, we discuss his passionate commitment to social mobility and his belief that people shouldn't have to rely on luck to succeed.

Among the themes we explore:

• Finding your own authentic leadership style
• The responsibilities and realities of becoming CEO
• Empowerment, delegation and avoiding micromanagement
• Leading transformation and embracing uncertainty
• AI and the future of professional development
• Social mobility and creating opportunities for others
• Learning from setbacks and disappointments
• Why leaders should make themselves redundant
• The importance of bravery, curiosity and relentless honesty

What particularly struck me was Malcolm's combination of ambition, humility and genuine concern for the people around him. His three leadership principles - authenticity, simplicity and relentless honesty - provide a wonderfully straightforward foundation for anyone aspiring to become a better leader.

Which of those three principles matters most to you, and why?

If you enjoy the conversation, please follow the podcast and share it with someone who might benefit from Malcolm's insights.

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Watch the full conversation on YouTube:
https://youtu.be/JYwqvukKU_Y

CONNECT WITH MALCOLM

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/malcolmgomersall/

Website: https://www.grantthornton.co.uk/

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What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
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What can happen when you say yes to an opportunity you never expected?

My guest for E167 of Leading 4 Life “Stories” is Manjinder Nagra, whose journey has taken her from a chance encounter with rugby to representing England in sumo. Sport also helped open a path into law, and she has gone on to help create opportunities for girls and women in sport.

Manjinder talks openly about growing up in an immigrant family, losing her father as a teenager, and facing racism, sexism and rejection. She explains how she kept going when the way ahead was uncertain, and why “why not?” has become a personal mantra.

We also discuss the role sport has played in her life, how to make it more welcoming for others, and why it’s never too late to take on a new challenge.

Among the themes we explore:

• Saying yes to opportunities that arrive unexpectedly
• Finding a way forward through rejection and bias
• How sport can build confidence and create new possibilities
• Moving from rugby to sumo and representing England
• Creating welcoming opportunities for girls and women
• Using your own experience to open doors for others

My takeaway is that a single opportunity can change the course of a life, but its effect can reach further when we use what we have learned to help others find their own way in.

What opportunity might you say yes to, even if it takes you somewhere you hadn’t planned?

If the conversation resonates with you, please share it with a friend or colleague and follow the podcast for future episodes.

Watch the video episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/B6xqrlphj0Y

CONNECT WITH MANJINDER

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/manjindernagra/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/manjnagra08/

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What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

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What kind of leader are you, and can you change your style when the situation demands it?

In this thematic episode, I explore six practical leadership styles: directive, visionary, participative, coaching, supportive and delegative.

Each has strengths. Each also has a potential shadow when it's overused.

Drawing on my own leadership journey from the RAF into senior military leadership and subsequently business, I explore why effective leadership isn't about finding one perfect style. It's about developing the range to use different approaches with different people in different circumstances.

I introduce a simple framework:

YOU - What is my instinctive response?
THEM - What do they need from me?
NOW - What does this moment require?

I also look at authenticity, psychometrics, what pressure does to our default behaviours and why adapting your leadership style doesn't mean changing who you are.

Same leader. Different behaviour.

Paid Patreon members can also access this week's Notes from the Cockpit, where I explore practical ways to expand your leadership range, supported by additional tools and exercises.

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JOIN THE CONVERSATION

What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob

What can life inside a simulated lunar habitat teach us about leadership, teamwork and the way we respond to pressure?

My guest for E165 of Leading 4 Life “Stories” is Caroline Clark, an analogue astronaut, keynote speaker and leadership development facilitator whose career has taken her from social housing into technology, health tech and psychology.

Caroline takes me inside the LunAres Research Station in Poland and explains the purpose of analogue missions on Earth. We talk about confined living, simulated spacewalks and the decisions a crew must make when a plan goes wrong. That leads us into a wider discussion about trust, autonomy and preparing people to solve problems for themselves.

We also explore what AI means for the development of future leaders, how Caroline approaches fear, and why understanding power and influence matters. Her account of burnout is particularly candid. She describes the pressures of combining an intense startup role with a psychology degree, the decision to leave her job, and how she began rebuilding the support around her.

Among the themes we explore:

• The human challenges of space exploration and their relevance to everyday leadership
• Giving teams room to think, learn and make decisions
• Curiosity, career changes and taking manageable steps into uncertainty
• Power literacy and recognising the choices available to you
• Resilience, relationships and the limits of pushing harder
• Honesty and compassion when a difficult question needs a direct answer

My takeaway is the importance of being deliberate about both independence and support. Teams need room to develop their judgement, and leaders need to recognise when their presence will help. Sustaining either requires attention to the people and systems around us.

Where could you give someone more room to think this week?

If the conversation resonates with you, please share it with a friend or colleague and follow the podcast for future episodes.

CONNECT WITH CAROLINE

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/carolineclarkspace/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/carolineclarkspace
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@carolineclarkspace
Substack: https://liftoff.carolineclark.space/
Website: https://expansum.space/

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JOIN THE CONVERSATION

What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob

As artificial intelligence becomes more capable, which human qualities will become even more valuable?

My guest in this episode is Al Vetch, Managing Partner at Gartner. Al began his career as a British Army officer, serving operationally in Northern Ireland and Bosnia, before moving into management consultancy and building a successful career advising organisations through complex transformation.

We explore what Al learned about leadership at Sandhurst and during his Army career, how those lessons transferred into business, and why human skills such as empathy, communication, creativity and judgement will remain essential in an increasingly technology-driven world.

IN THIS EPISODE

• Al’s journey from Sandhurst and operational Army service to Gartner
• The difference between leadership and management
• Confidence without arrogance and the importance of professional competence
• Why leadership is learned through experience, responsibility and reflection
• How AI could transform jobs, organisations and the development of future leaders
• The danger of removing junior roles that provide essential experience
• Creating environments in which people can take risks and learn from mistakes
• The value of honest debriefing, feedback, mentoring and continuous development
• Resilience, failure and Al’s unsuccessful attempts at Special Forces selection
• Wellbeing, family, travel, science fiction and blues music

Behind the conversation lies an important message. Technology may change what people do, but leadership remains fundamentally human. Organisations will still need people who can exercise judgement, build trust, inspire teams, communicate clearly and take responsibility when the answer is uncertain.

Which human leadership quality do you believe will become most important as AI develops? Please share your thoughts and let me know what stood out for you.

FIND OUT MORE

Connect with Al Vetch on LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/alastair-vetch-ba6a043/

Find out more about Gartner:
https://www.gartner.com/

Find out more about my keynote speaking, leadership workshops and executive coaching:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

WATCH THE VIDEO

This episode is also available as a full video podcast on YouTube:
https://youtu.be/SlhEsOxL0-8

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What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob

What does it take to refuel a fast jet in flight—when the manoeuvre begins by deliberately flying towards another aircraft?

In this personal episode of Leading 4 Life “Stories”, I explain why air-to-air refuelling is such an important force multiplier, extending the range and endurance of combat aircraft and providing operational flexibility that would otherwise be impossible.

I take you inside probe-and-drogue refuelling: how the pilot approaches the basket, establishes contact and keeps the aircraft stable while fuel is transferred. I explain why chasing the basket can create dangerous oscillations and why smoothness, anticipation and disciplined control inputs matter so much.

I recall learning the skill in the Jaguar after joining 54 (Fighter) Squadron as an experienced flight commander, as well as refuelling operationally in turbulence over the mountains of southern Turkey and northern Iraq.

I also explore the challenges of long tanker trails across the Atlantic and North America—including remaining connected for up to 25 minutes in a Jaguar without an autopilot—and contrast the probe-and-drogue method with the American boom-refuelling system I experienced in the Phantom.

There's also a little bit of imposter syndrome in there! When I arrived on 54 Squadron, I had zero experience of a basic skill that all the junior pilots were already past masters at - that definitely gave me pause for thought until I mastered it myself!

Behind the aviation lies a wider lesson: when the margins are small, forcing a correction can amplify the problem. Calmness, preparation and small, deliberate actions are often what restore stability.

Have you experienced air-to-air refuelling as a pilot, tanker crewmember or passenger—or is there another aspect of military aviation you would like me to cover? Please share your experience or let me know what stood out for you.

Find out more about my keynote speaking, leadership workshops and executive coaching:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

WATCH THE VIDEO

This episode is also available as a full video podcast on YouTube:
https://youtu.be/XwVKex5ogTU

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JOIN THE CONVERSATION

What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob

What does it take to fly a fast jet just six feet from another aircraft—and why would you need to?

In this personal episode of Leading 4 Life “Stories”, I take you inside the demanding world of formation flying. I explain how pilots learn to operate safely at extremely close quarters, the different purposes served by close and tactical formations, and why smoothness, predictability and disciplined communication matter so much.

I explore flying through cloud, night formation, tactical mutual support, battle turns and the progression from simply flying an aircraft to operating it as part of an effective fighting formation.

I also recall some memorable experiences from my RAF career, including leading the 49-aircraft flypast for Queen Elizabeth II’s 80th birthday, leading the first nine-aircraft Typhoon formation flown by any of the four Eurofighter nations, and flying surrounded by 15 other Jaguars in a Diamond 16.

Behind the aviation lies a wider lesson: high-performing teams depend on trust, preparation, clearly understood roles and people doing the right thing at precisely the right moment.

Have you ever flown in formation—or seen a formation display that has stayed with you? Please share your experience or let me know what you found most interesting. Your feedback helps me shape future personal-story episodes.

Find out more about my keynote speaking, leadership workshops and executive coaching:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

A small change from this episode: titles will now place the subject of each programme first, making the content easier to identify and discover. The episode numbering and Leading 4 Life “Stories” series remain unchanged.

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This episode is also available as a full video podcast on YouTube:
https://youtu.be/HDB_jKFD-5I

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What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
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X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob

Before you do anything else, please hit the subscribe / follow button in your podcast platform to ensure you get immediate notification of future episodes, and to help boost this show within the algorithms.

This episode is also available as a video podcast on my YouTube channel here:

https://youtu.be/gofJ-LfvFeQ

Laura McCracken has had the most amazing career, and so it is no surprise whatsoever that she is now the highly successful founder of Blackheath Advisors & The Board Alchemist, and spends her time advising top level leaders from across the array of business sectors.

This was a great conversation, not least because Laura and I are operating in similar spaces with similar objectives, albeit having had very different career journeys on the way through. We discuss a wide range of topics, with a strong focus on leadership development and I hope that you will find the episode both interesting and useful, regardless of your own current role.

As ever, I would love your feedback so please do let me know what you think of the episode once you have had a listen, and if you enjoy it, please spread the word so that others get the benefit of Laura's excellent words of advice.

You can find Laura here:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauramccracken/

Website: https://www.blackheathadvisors.com/

Substack: https://substack.com/@lauramccracken2

Send me a Text Message

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JOIN THE CONVERSATION

What stood out for you in this episode? I would genuinely welcome your thoughts, experiences and suggestions for future programmes. Use the “Send me a Text Message” link above or leave a comment on YouTube.

If you enjoyed the episode, please follow Leading 4 Life “Stories” on your podcast platform so that you receive future episodes automatically. Sharing it with someone who might find it valuable is also one of the best ways to support the show.

SUPPORT LEADING 4 LIFE “STORIES”

If you value the content and would like to help me continue producing the podcast, you can become a Supporter, Champion or Patron by clicking the "Support the show" link above or by going to:
https://www.patreon.com/leading4life/

Any contribution is greatly appreciated, but listening, following, sharing and providing feedback are equally valuable.

CONNECT WITH BOB JUDSON

LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judsonbob/

Website:
https://leading4life.co.uk/

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@Leading4Life

X:
https://x.com/JudsonBob