Why Distance Learning? copertina

Why Distance Learning?

Why Distance Learning?

Di: Seth Fleischauer Allyson Mitchell and Tami Moehring
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Why Distance Learning? is a podcast about the decisions, design choices, and assumptions that determine whether live virtual learning becomes shallow and transactional—or meaningful, relational, and effective at scale. The show is designed for education leaders, instructional designers, and system-level practitioners responsible for adopting, scaling, and sustaining virtual, hybrid, and online learning models. Each episode examines the structural conditions under which distance learning actually works—and the predictable reasons it fails when it doesn’t. Through conversations with researchers, experienced practitioners, and field-shaping leaders, Why Distance Learning? translates research, field evidence, and lived experience into decision-relevant insight. Episodes surface real tradeoffs, near-failures, and hard-won lessons, equipping listeners with clear framing and language they can use to explain, defend, or redesign distance learning models in real organizational contexts. Hosted by Seth Fleischauer of Banyan Global Learning, and Allyson Mitchell and Tami Moehring of the Center for Interactive Learning and Collaboration, the podcast challenges outdated narratives about distance learning and explores what becomes possible when live virtual education is designed intentionally, human-centered, and grounded in evidence.© 2024 Why Distance Learning?
Episodi
  • #83 Can Flexibility Hurt Online Learners? What Pacing Data Reveals with Kristen DeBruler

    #83 Can Flexibility Hurt Online Learners? What Pacing Data Reveals with Kristen DeBruler
    Jun 22 2026
    In this episode of Why Distance Learning, your hosts talk with Kristen DeBruler — Assistant Director of the Michigan Virtual Learning Research Institute — about what makes online learning work for K-12 students, and what quietly undermines it. Drawing on survey data from over a thousand virtual teachers and fresh findings on student and teacher AI perceptions, her work reveals where the conventional promises of online learning diverge from what the data actually shows. The episode centers on a tension that practitioners rarely name directly: the flexibility that makes online learning valuable for some students can work against those who are still developing the self-regulation skills to use it well.Together, the hosts and Kristen explore how a researcher inside a state virtual learning organization sets and pursues a research agenda — including the unusual advantage of having direct access to student data. They examine common failure modes in classroom-level research, particularly how vague research questions leave teachers vulnerable to the biases they're trying to surface. Kristen walks through her team's findings on the gap between how students and teachers define acceptable AI use, and why that ambiguity is already showing up in the classroom. The conversation turns to teacher feedback as the connective tissue of asynchronous online learning — and what the data shows about what makes it work and what makes it hollow. And Kristen makes a pointed case about applying adult learning research to K-12 populations: the data doesn't transfer as cleanly as the field sometimes assumes, and the consequences land on students who are still building the executive functioning skills that adult learners already have. Her pacing research is illustrative: students who cross unit boundaries — not just move around within one — end up with final grades 9.5 points lower on average, a gap large enough that teachers should treat it as a warning signal, not background noise.Key topics:Researcher role inside a state virtual learning organizationSetting a research agenda: legislative directives vs. internal needsAvoiding bias in classroom-level researchThe AI acceptable-use gap between students and teachersTeacher feedback as the primary relationship-building mechanism in async coursesWhat makes feedback substantive (personal, formative, actionable) vs. hollowAI-generated feedback and trust erosion in online learningStudent pacing deviation and its effect on learning outcomesExecutive functioning support for K-12 online learnersCautions in applying adult learning research to adolescentsLinks & ResourcesMichigan Virtual: https://michiganvirtual.orgMichigan Virtual Digital Backpack (blog): https://michiganvirtual.org/blog/Michigan Virtual research publications: https://michiganvirtual.org/research/publications/Cuccolo, K. & DeBruler, K. (2024). A Look Back At 3 Years of Michigan Virtual Research. Michigan Virtual. — Source of the AI policy gap data (30%/80%) and AI facilitator vs. task-completion findings. https://michiganvirtual.org/research/publications/a-look-back-at-3-years-of-michigan-virtual-research/Cuccolo, K. & DeBruler, K. (2024). Out of Order, Out of Reach: Navigating Assignment Sequences for STEM Success. Michigan Virtual. — Source of the 9.5-point pacing deviation finding. https://michiganvirtual.org/research/publications/out-of-order-out-of-reach-navigating-assignment-sequences-for-stem-success/DeBruler, K. & Harrington, C. (2024). Key Strategies for Supporting Disengaged and Struggling Students in Virtual Learning Environments. Michigan Virtual. https://michiganvirtual.org/research/publications/key-strategies-for-supporting-disengaged-and-struggling-students-in-virtual-learning-environments/Harrington, C. & DeBruler, K. (2021). Key Strategies for Engaging Students in Virtual Learning Environments. Michigan Virtual. https://michiganvirtual.org/research/publications/key-strategies-for-engaging-students-in-virtual-learning-environments/Michigan Virtual report on student and teacher AI perceptions (2026): [LINK — get from guest; published ~2 weeks before recording]Jared Borup's ACE for Community Framework: https://edtechbooks.org/encyclopedia/academic_communities_of_engagement_ace_framework Virtual Learning Leadership Alliance (VLLA): https://virtuallearningalliance.org/Karle Delo, Michigan Virtual (AI policy): https://michiganvirtual.org (search staff directory)Why Distance Learning Michigan Virtual Episodes: See list for episodes with Dr. Tovah Sheldon and two with MV alum Chris Harrington. https://www.cilc.org/News-(1)/Why-Distance-Learning-Podcast.aspxMake It Mindful Michigan Virtual Episodes: See list from Seth's other podcast for episodes with Karle Delo and two with Aaron Baughman. https://mim.bepodcast.network/episodesGuest Bio: Kristen DeBrulerKristen DeBruler is the Assistant Director of the Michigan Virtual Learning Research Institute, where she has spent more than 14 years studying K-...
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    34 min
  • #82 All Learning Is Social: Jered Borup on Social Presence in K-12 Online Learning (Part 2)

    #82 All Learning Is Social: Jered Borup on Social Presence in K-12 Online Learning (Part 2)
    Jun 8 2026
    In this episode of Why Distance Learning, your hosts continue their conversation with Jered Borup — professor at George Mason University and one of the most-cited researchers in K-12 online learning — about what AI in education is actually doing to relationships, what social presence requires when "build a video lecture" can be done by a chatbot, and why teacher burnout is the real bottleneck the field doesn't want to talk about. Borup connects his earliest 2012 work on asynchronous video to his 2025 Open Praxis research on combining AI-generated text with human-created video, and argues that AI used to offload feedback erodes the very thing online learners need: the felt sense that the teacher is real and knows them.Together, the hosts and Jered explore the conflation of social media, video games, and ed tech in the parental imagination after the pandemic; how to use AI without replacing the relational core of teaching; why one-on-one asynchronous video may build social presence more reliably than synchronous Zoom classes; the DLAC Phase 2 research agenda Borup co-authored with Michael Barbour and Kristen DeBruler; the mental-health gap between teachers and other professionals with comparable education; and Borup's one-line answer to the show's title question — that personalization and Universal Design for Learning are easier to do online than off.This is Part 2 of a two-part conversation. Listen to Part 1 for the foundational ACE framework, the on-site mentor model, and the parent question.Key Topics"Emergency remote learning" vs. real online learning — what parents are still confusingSocial presence — old research, new tools (asynchronous video, AI-plus-human-video)The risk of offloading teacher feedback to AIAsynchronous one-on-one video as a relationship lever (vs. one-to-many Zoom)DLAC Research Agenda Phase 2 — what's keeping researchers up at nightTeacher mental health and the AI strain on top of pandemic strainAuthentic assessment and "we're too in love with the five-paragraph essay"Empathy as the core design move"Why distance learning?" — empowerment, personalization, UDLLinks & ResourcesJered Borup's site: https://sites.google.com/site/jeredborup/ACE Framework on EdTech Books: https://edtechbooks.org/encyclopedia/academic_communities_of_engagement_ace_frameworkA Framework for Establishing Social Presence Through the Combination of AI-generated Text with Human-created Video (Open Praxis, 2025): https://openpraxis.org/articles/10.55982/openpraxis.17.1.769Harnessing the Power of Generative AI to Support ALL Learners (Borup, Evmenova & Shin, 2024): https://www.researchgate.net/publication/380570253_Harnessing_the_Power_of_Generative_AI_to_Support_ALL_LearnersDLAC Research Agenda Phase Two (Borup, Barbour & DeBruler, Sept 2025): https://www.deelac.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/DLAC-Research-Agenda-Phase-2-Final-1052025.pdfBreaking Through the Screen: Practical Tips for Engaging Learners in the Online and Blended Classroom (Borup & Joan Kang Shin, National Geographic Learning): https://www.amazon.com/Breaking-Through-Screen-Practical-classroom/dp/0357541855K-12 Blended Teaching open-source book series: https://edtechbooks.org/k12blended_seriesJered's Google Scholar: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=PGs7TacAAAAJ&hl=enPart 1 of this conversation: [LINK — add when published]Guest Bio: Jered BorupJered Borup is a professor in the Division of Learning Technologies at George Mason University and co-coordinator of the Learning Technologies in Schools graduate program. His research, grounded in six years of junior-high history teaching, focuses on K-12 online and blended learning: the support communities that surround a learner, the parental role in online education, and how generative AI can extend personalized support to historically underserved students. He earned his Ph.D. in Instructional Psychology and Technology from Brigham Young University and has been recognized as one of the top 2% most-cited researchers in his field.About the HostsSeth Fleischauer is the founder of Banyan Global Learning and host of Why Distance Learning. Through Banyan, he designs live virtual programs that connect K-12 classrooms to global peers and expert facilitators — building the kind of structured, human-centered distance learning the podcast explores. See https://banyangloballearning.com/Allyson Mitchell works with CILC, the Center for Interactive Learning and Collaboration, to help educators implement high-quality live virtual learning experiences across grade levels. Discover more at CILC.org.
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    32 min
  • #81 School and Personal Communities Must Work Together to Make Online Learning Engaging with Jered Borup

    #81 School and Personal Communities Must Work Together to Make Online Learning Engaging with Jered Borup
    May 26 2026
    In this episode of Why Distance Learning, your hosts talk with Jered Borup — professor at George Mason University, co-creator of the Academic Communities of Engagement framework, and one of the most-cited researchers in K-12 online learning — about why student engagement isn't a property of the student or a skill the teacher unlocks, and why most online programs are leaving the work undone. Borup's framework distinguishes the course community (teachers, designers, mentors) from the personal community (parents, family, on-site adults) and argues engagement is what those two produce together. The assumption on the table: that "more parental involvement" is what fixes online learning — when in fact, untrained involvement, his research shows, can hurt about as often as it helps.Together, the hosts and Jered explore the ACE framework's two communities, the on-site mentor model from Mountain Heights Academy and Michigan's mentor mandate, what it actually takes to teach a student how to learn online, the equity gap in who gets meaningful support, and where parents fit (and don't). Along the way: the Michigan administrator who tapped someone on the shoulder and said "you're now Sally's mentor," the parent with only a high-school diploma who turned out to be one of the 12 most successful mentors in the study, and the parent who confessed to Jered that she does her kid's online discussion-board posts because they're "busy work."This is Part 1 of a two-part conversation.Key TopicsThe Academic Communities of Engagement (ACE) frameworkCourse community vs. personal communityOn-site mentors as the missing link in K-12 online learningMichigan's mentor mandate — and why fidelity varies by schoolWhy "improved" parental engagement matters more than "more"Designing parent support: a trickle of just-in-time tips, not a classThe equity gap in self-regulation and "how to learn online"Links & ResourcesJered Borup's site: https://sites.google.com/site/jeredborup/ACE Framework on EdTech Books: https://edtechbooks.org/encyclopedia/academic_communities_of_engagement_ace_frameworkAcademic Communities of Engagement (Borup, Graham et al., ETR&D, 2020): https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11423-020-09744-xBehind the Screen: Exploring Parental Roles in K-12 Online Education (Sandberg & Borup, Journal of Research on Technology in Education, 2025): https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/15391523.2024.2447729Parental Support Challenges for K-12 Student Online Engagement (Sandberg, Borup et al., Distance Education, 2024): https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/01587919.2024.2397481Michigan Virtual — Why Mentors Matter: A Conversation with Jered Borup: https://michiganvirtual.org/blog/why-mentors-matter-a-conversation-with-jered-borup/K–12 Blended Teaching (open-source book series): https://edtechbooks.org/k12blended_seriesBobbi Sandberg episode (Why Distance Learning): [LINK — add when published]Guest Bio: Jered BorupJered Borup is a professor in the Division of Learning Technologies at George Mason University and co-coordinator of the Learning Technologies in Schools graduate program. His research, grounded in six years of junior-high history teaching, focuses on K-12 online and blended learning: the support communities that surround a learner, the parental role in online education, and how generative AI can extend personalized support to historically underserved students. He earned his Ph.D. in Instructional Psychology and Technology from Brigham Young University and has been recognized as one of the top 2% most-cited researchers in his field.About the HostsSeth Fleischauer is the founder of Banyan Global Learning and host of Why Distance Learning. Through Banyan, he designs live virtual programs that connect K-12 classrooms to global peers and expert facilitators — building the kind of structured, human-centered distance learning the podcast explores. See https://banyangloballearning.com/Allyson Mitchell works with CILC, the Center for Interactive Learning and Collaboration, to help educators implement high-quality live virtual learning experiences across grade levels. Discover more at CILC.org.
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    32 min
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