Ashok Subramanian shares the real story behind leaving McKinsey, building Liazon from nothing, nearly running out of payroll multiple times, and ultimately selling the company in a lightning-fast acquisition that changed everything. Along the way, he reveals how founders misjudge risk, why most "great ideas" are actually wrong, and what it really takes to build something that lasts inside a broken healthcare system.

In this episode, Jeff Munn and Ashok unpack:

• Why the scariest part of entrepreneurship isn't failing — it's succeeding
• How Liazon pivoted from a dead-end pilot into a billion-dollar acquisition
• What founders get wrong about exits, risk, and building inside big companies

Whether you're starting your first company or scaling your fifth, this conversation will challenge how you think about risk, leadership, and what it means to truly build something.

The stakes only go up — but so does what you're capable of.

Guest: Ashok Subramanian
🔗 Centivo: centivo.com

Host: Jeff Munn
🎙 Pick Now Podcast
🔗 LinkedIn: jeffmunn

What if the biggest thing holding your business back… is you?

This week, Jeff sits down with Michael Pickel for a candid coaching conversation about leadership, control, and learning to get out of your own way. Michael reflects on overthinking decisions, being too hard on himself, and how unintentionally holding on too tightly can limit a team's growth.

Together, they unpack the difference between expectations and agreements, why control and growth can't coexist, and how real leadership often means creating space—for your team and for yourself.

What if the only thing standing between you and the opportunity of a lifetime is the belief that you belong there?
Norm Volsky shares how a career in recruiting turned into an entrepreneurial engine—helping scale category-defining healthcare companies like Livongo and Hinge Health, and eventually launching his own investment platform. Along the way, Norm reveals how conviction, timing, and relentless value creation compound into outsized impact.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• Why progress isn't linear—and why that's a good thing
• How betting on people early can change everything
• The mindset shift that turns "Why me?" into momentum
  
  

If you've ever felt on the edge of something bigger, this conversation might be the push you need.

What if the biggest career risk isn't starting a company—but never betting on yourself?

Matt Kuta shares why most people wildly overestimate the danger of entrepreneurship while ignoring the hidden instability of corporate life. Drawing from his journey as a fighter pilot, private equity investor, and founder who took a defense and space company public, Matt reframes risk, failure, and what it really means to live without regret.

In this conversation, Jeff and Matt explore why clarity beats comfort, how public failure is less dangerous than people think, and why building something uncertain can actually be the safest move of all.

Key takeaways include:

• Why staying at a "secure" company may be riskier than starting a business
• How entrepreneurs often have more clarity and control than corporate employees
• Why fear of public failure keeps talented people from ever starting
  
  

If you've ever felt stuck choosing safety over purpose—or wondered what future you might regret—this episode will challenge how you think about risk, courage, and career decisions.

In this episode, Jeff sits down with someone who's been in the trenches, taken big swings, gotten knocked flat, and gotten back up again — Mo Bunnell, founder and CEO of Bunnell Idea Group and bestselling author of The Snowball System and Give to Grow.

Mo's story isn't a straight line. It's a series of pivots, experiments, wrong turns, bold moves, and moments when he had to trust himself enough to take the next step. Jeff and Mo talk about the quiet fear that comes with stepping out on your own, the 100-day cash crisis that pushed him to rebuild from scratch, and the principles that guided him from actuarial spreadsheets to training more than 60,000 people around the world.

Connect with Mo:

Website: bunnellideagroup.com

LinkedIn: Mo Bunnell

Books: Amazon

YouTube: @MoBunnell1

This week, Jeff talks with Eric Elwer, founder of Stepping Stone, about what happens when the feeling of being unsettled becomes impossible to ignore. Eric shares how a dark season, a moment of unexpected clarity, and a simple notebook sketch led him from a successful corporate career into the uncertainty—and purpose—of entrepreneurship.

He opens up about rebuilding a product from scratch, learning to make hard decisions fast, and the role faith and intuition played in reshaping his life. What emerges is not a story about technology, but about alignment, courage, and becoming the version of yourself you didn't know existed.

If you've been waiting for the "right" moment to begin, this conversation is an invitation: Start before you're ready. The path appears when you choose it.

Connect with Eric:

Website: mysteppingstone.ai

LinkedIn: Eric Elwer

Email: eric@mysteppingstone.ai

What if the biggest win in your career comes from saying no?
In this episode, Jeff sits down with entrepreneur and investor Michael McAllister — founder of The CE Shop, a bootstrapped startup that grew into a national leader in professional licensing education and ultimately exited in a nine-figure private equity recap. Michael shares how he went from selling dictation equipment door-to-door to scaling a tech-enabled education platform, and the surprising moment he walked away from a massive acquisition deal because it didn't align with his values.

Michael opens up about the deeper why behind his drive: growing up around scarcity, learning to innovate under pressure, and discovering that entrepreneurship is as much a spiritual journey as a strategic one.

We explore:

• How crisis moments can force your most important innovations
• Why gut instinct is a business tool, not just a feeling
• What it takes to build (and protect) a people-first culture
• How to choose the right private equity partner — not just the highest bidder
  
  

This conversation is a reminder that the real reward isn't just the exit — it's who you become along the way.

Listen in and get inspired to bet on yourself.

Connect with Michael McAllister:
The CE Shop: https://www.theceshop.com

Connect with Jeff Munn:
LinkedIn: jeffmunn
The Pick Now: jmunn.com

Some leaders chase success. Others build it quietly, brick by brick, through discipline, pain, curiosity, and an unwillingness to settle. In this episode, Jeff sits down with serial entrepreneur and explorer Hans Kaspersetz, whose life has been shaped by adversity, near-death cave dives, 14 failed startups, and a belief that the universe doesn't bring us this far just to let us fall. Hans reveals how coding before he could read led him into entrepreneurship, why meditation and fear inventories became survival tools, and how pushing limits helps him redefine purpose.

Connect with Jeff:

https://linktr.ee/jeffmunn

Learn More About Hans:

Website: oralucent.com

Code MUNN20 for 20% off your order

LinkedIn: Hans Kaspersetz

About Our Guest:

Hans Kaspersetz is the CEO of Oralucent, a groundbreaking oral care company pioneering the use of red and blue light therapy to improve gum health, whiten teeth, and support systemic wellness.

A seasoned entrepreneur with multiple successful exits and a track record of building a $100M enterprise, Hans has spent more than 20 years at the intersection of health technology, consumer wellness, and marketing innovation. Outside the boardroom, Hans is an avid cave explorer and ultramarathon runner, channeling the same curiosity and endurance that drive his business ventures. Hans is an early stage investor with more than a dozen companies in his portfolio and multiple advisory roles that focus on operations and scaling.

Having endured his own oral health and health challenges, Hans is passionate about the science of oral light therapy, its emerging synergistic links to the biohacking and longevity landscape, and why your mouth may be the new frontier of whole-body health.