It’s the end of 2025 and 2026 is “coming in hot,” so Ciarra and Cass take a breath and do what we all say we’re going to do… but rarely actually do: look back at the year with honesty. They unpack the messy mix of grief and growth, the pressure Black women carry to be “perfect,” and how burnout shows up in the body (including Ciarra’s vocal nodules). From hustle identity to community care, they explore what it means to build a life that’s not just productive, but humane.

The episode closes with a powerful “sacred dissent” exchange—each friend naming what they hope the other carries into 2026: less pressure, more self-trust, deeper receiving, and a reminder that you don’t have to “arrive” to be worthy.

🌿 Find Cass & Ciarra Online
✨ Instagram: @RightThereWithYouPod
✨ Patreon: patreon.com/thecommunitygarden
✨ Cass: iamcasscooper.com | TikTok @just_cass2.0
✨ Ciarra: ciarajonesconsulting.com | TikTok @thegardeningtheologian

What if God was never a punisher—and hell was never the point?

In this powerful episode of Right There With You, hosts Cass Cooper and Ciarra Jones sit down with public theologians Tamice Spencer-Helms (Faith Unleavened) and Brian Recker (Hell Bent) to explore how fear, whiteness, and Christian supremacy have shaped American Christianity and the spiritual lives of millions.

Together, they unpack:

• How hell theology produces fear, shame, and control
• Why a punitive view of God leads to a punitive society
• The role of whiteness in shaping Christian identity, belonging, and power
• What it means to be Black, queer, and spiritually rooted outside colonized faith
• How to heal from religious trauma and rebuild spirituality in love
• Why restorative justice aligns more with Jesus than fear-based salvation
• The wilderness between Trayvon Martin and George Floyd—and what liberation looks like after loss

This conversation is tender, challenging, funny, and liberating. It’s for anyone navigating deconstruction, exvangelical healing, racial justice, queerness, parenting, divorce, co-parenting, or redefining their relationship to God.

If you’ve ever feared hell, questioned God’s love, or felt pushed out of church spaces—you’re right there with us.

Author of Faith Unleavened: The Wilderness Between Trayvon Martin & George Floyd
Founder, theologian, cultural critic, and co-creator of The Ember Gathering, a post-evangelical liberation event.

Author of Hell Bent: How the Fear of Hell Holds Christians Back from a Spirituality of Love
Former evangelical pastor, restorative justice advocate, and co-founder of The Ember Gathering.

🌿 Find Cass & Ciarra Online
✨ Instagram: @RightThereWithYouPod
✨ Patreon: patreon.com/thecommunitygarden
✨ Cass: iamcasscooper.com | TikTok @just_cass2.0
✨ Ciarra: ciarajonesconsulting.com | TikTok @thegardeningtheologian

In this episode of Right There With You, Cass and Ciarra tackle the uncomfortable truth: the male gaze is not ministry. From pulpits to platforms, patriarchal theology has long defined what holiness looks like—especially for women and queer folks.

Together, they explore how deconstruction, feminism, and faith intersect when the church’s obsession with purity, power, and performance collides with real people’s lives.

The conversation dives deep into spiritual grooming, gendered accountability, sexual repression, and performative forgiveness, asking: what happens when control is mistaken for care?

Cass and Ciarra illuminate the path toward sacred agency, reminding listeners that embodiment, truth-telling, and community care are not rebellion—they’re revival.

🌿 Find Cass & Ciarra Online
✨ Instagram: @RightThereWithYouPod
✨ Patreon: patreon.com/thecommunitygarden
✨ Cass: iamcasscooper.com | TikTok @just_cass2.0
✨ Ciarra: ciarajonesconsulting.com | TikTok @thegardeningtheologian