We sat down with Dr. Natalie Houghtby-Haddon, a longtime colleague of both Bonnie and Ina through the George Washington University Center for Excellence in Public Leadership (GW CEPL). Our conversation began with her new role as Executive Director of the Center, stepping in at a time of transition and uncertainty. For more than two decades, the Center has focused largely on federal government leadership training, but as that landscape shifts, so does CEPL’s direction.

Originally launched to support local government employees, the Center quickly evolved to serve the federal workforce, adding executive coaching to its offerings along the way. Now, with the emergence of “CEPL 4.0,” the Center, led by Dr. Houghtby-Haddon, is looking beyond public service to develop leadership training for corporations and other sectors. It’s a moment of challenge, but also opportunity.

With Dr. Houghtby-Haddon at the helm, we explored how her lifelong commitment to building healthy, just, and sustainable communities informs this next chapter. That guiding principle first led her to the United Nations, then with a desire to make more of a direct impact in the community, she became a clergywoman and spent two decades pastoring churches in Southern California. Throughout her career, Dr. Houghtby-Haddon has helped people reimagine what’s possible in their lives and communities.

She shared her powerful framework of the “four worlds”—mythic, communal, social, and cultural—interconnected spheres that help us navigate change and envision new ways of being. Drawing on her experience across leadership, ministry, and public service, she spoke about her personal philosophy and how both failures and successes have shaped her journey.

Dr. Houghtby-Haddon also walked us through five key leadership perspectives that have influenced her thinking and continue to do so at the pivotal time for the Center: Scientific Management, Excellence, Values-Based Leadership, Trust and Cultural Leadership, and Whole-Person Leadership. Each contributes to a holistic view of how leaders and the organizations they serve can thrive in times of transformation.

Toward the end of the conversation, we returned to Dr. Houghtby-Haddon’s model and how it inspires people to move beyond it in pursuit of their fullest potential. She spoke about the importance of letting go of the old and welcoming the new—something she’s experiencing first hand at the Center, where the future is uncertain but full of exciting possibilities to rethink leadership and help leaders lean into their full potential. Don’t miss our lightning round at the end of the conversation to find out what Dr. Houghtby-Haddon might do if she had all the time in the world, where she might spend it, and what she’s currently reading. It’s a fascinating conversation that really opens the mind, and we hope you enjoy it as much as we did.