Dr. Judson Brewer is a psychiatrist + neuroscientist and Director of Research & Innovation at Brown University’s Mindfulness Center. Subscribe for more long-form interviews on science, self-improvement, and human behavior.

Expect to Learn:

Why willpower fails under stress (and why the prefrontal cortex is a fragile “control” strategy).How habits are shaped by reward learning and why awareness is the real “lever” for change.How to use mindful attention to make cravings feel less rewarding (+ the smoking example that surprises almost everyone).

The habit loop framework: trigger → behavior → result (and why “triggers” are often the least important part).What the default mode network is, and why it’s linked to self-referential thinking and craving.How “curiosity” becomes a bigger, better offer than worry, craving, or self-judgment.A practical grounding tool for anxious moments: five-finger breathing (and why it helps bring the brain back online).How anxiety can function like a habit and what Dr. Jud’s research has found with app-based training (including major symptom reduction reported in his work).

00:00 — How to break bad habits: start with how your brain learns (not willpower)

00:30 — Willpower is a myth: why “just stop” fails under stress

02:16 — Neuroscience of habit formation: reward learning, dopamine, and prediction error

02:44 — The real key to habit change: awareness (why attention rewires behavior)

04:22 — Real-world habit change: smoking + overeating (making cravings feel unrewarding)

07:54 — Triggers explained: why environment matters less than the reward outcome

15:47 — Mindfulness + the default mode network: self-focus, craving, and meditation

25:35 — Curiosity beats cravings: the “bigger better offer” for breaking habits

40:24 — Practical tools for anxiety + habit change (what to do in the moment)

44:13 — Dr. Jud’s anxiety story: how mindfulness helped panic + stress symptoms

44:28 — Empathy → evidence-based programs: turning patient needs into training systems

46:19 — Anxiety meds reality check: why “gold standard” helps only a minority long-term

48:35 — Building an anxiety app: using neuroscience to train skills (not dependency)

50:04 — Can anxiety be a habit? negative reinforcement, worry loops, and action bias

55:40 — Exercise + healthy routines: helpful… unless it becomes an avoidance habit

01:01:49 — Social media & AI addiction: engineered attention + RLHF “sycophant” bots

01:16:02 — Meaning, service, and curiosity: philosophical reflections to end the episode

01:19:22 — Final links, program mention, and closing remarks

Judson’s Work

Going Beyond Anxiety (program):

https://www.goingbeyondanxiety.com

Dr. Jud’s site (resources + programs):

https://drjud.com

Dr. Jud bio / research background: https://mindfulness.sph.brown.edu/people/judson-brewerBrown University researcher profile: https://vivo.brown.edu/display/jbrewer2

Jacob’s WorkYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@jacobjwatsonhowlandSpotify:

Apple Podcasts:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jacobwatsonhowlandX: https://x.com/jwatsonhowlandLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/watsonhowlandWebsite:

https://www.jacobjwatsonhowland.com

What’s one bad habit you’ve tried to “willpower” your way out of, and what do you think the real reward was?

#BadHabits #Mindfulness #Neuroscience