In this episode of Following Waters, host Brett Mayer speaks with Hattie Johnson of American Whitewater about her roots as a paddler and conservationist—and then dives deep into one of the most pressing river access issues in the country right now: the legal right to float in Colorado.

Hattie shares how her personal relationship with rivers led her into conservation work, before walking listeners through the history of river access law in Colorado, how we arrived at the current moment, and why long-standing assumptions about paddlers’ rights are being challenged. Together, they unpack the evolving legal landscape, what recent conflicts mean for paddlers across the state, and why this issue extends far beyond Colorado’s borders.

The conversation is both a primer and a call to awareness—helping paddlers understand the legal, historical, and political context of river access, while clarifying how individuals and communities can stay informed, engaged, and involved in protecting the ability to float rivers now and into the future.

Topics include:

1. Hattie’s pathway to rivers as both a paddler and conservationist
2. The history of the right to float in Colorado
3. Why river access is being challenged now
4. What’s changed—and what’s at stake for paddlers
5. How American Whitewater is responding
6. Practical ways paddlers can stay engaged and support access efforts

This is a timely and important conversation for anyone who cares about rivers, access, and the future of paddling in the United States.

Mentioned in this episode:

JointheACA

In this episode of Following Waters, host Brett Mayer sits down with whitewater kayaker Isaac Hull, whose relationship with paddling began unusually early. Sponsored by the age of ten, Isaac effectively grew up alongside the river, learning not only how to paddle but how to navigate identity, expectations, and opportunity within the sport from a young age.

The conversation traces how that early immersion shaped Isaac’s development as a paddler and as a person—from formative trips and long days on the water to the realities of growing up sponsored in a relatively small, tight-knit community. Isaac reflects on how early exposure influenced his approach to risk, progression, and longevity in the sport.

Looking forward, the discussion explores how Isaac’s relationship with kayaking continues to evolve, what drives him now, and how time, perspective, and experience have reshaped his goals.

Check out Isaac's instagram page to check out some of the drops we talked about in this episode, including Young's River Falls, and the log dodge in Mexico.

Mentioned in this episode:

JointheACA

JointheACA

In this episode of Following Waters, host Brett Mayer speaks with Risa Shimoda about her path through whitewater paddling and into river conservation leadership. Risa shares how she learned to kayak as a young adult in the Ohio and gradually developed her skills, becoming part of the early wave of women pushing into more difficult whitewater.

She reflects on landmark experiences including pioneering women’s descents in places like the Niagara Gorge, and how deeper engagement in the sport led her toward work in the paddlesports industry with Perception Kayaks. The conversation then traces her transition into conservation, including serving as the first Executive Director of American Whitewater, and her current role as Executive Director of the River Management Society. The episode focuses on how long-term involvement in paddling can evolve into leadership, advocacy, and stewardship.

1. River Management Society

A podcast sponsored by the American Canoe Association featuring stories of education, stewardship, adventure, and competition that shape our collective connection to water.

We create access through storytelling — offering insights and inspiration from the worlds shaped by rivers.

One story at a time, we honor the people, places, and ideas that make paddling possible.

About the Host, Brett Mayer

Brett’s connection to water began long before he picked up a paddle — growing up outdoors, studying environmental science and policy, and developing a deep interest in the ways people form bonds with place. After a Division I soccer career, he transitioned fully into the natural world, finding in paddling a profound sense of connection and purpose.

In 2003, Brett began kayaking, eventually becoming a sponsored paddler working with several outdoor brands, traveling widely, and competing in a range of races. He later became an ACA Level IV whitewater instructor, founded and operated a river school and adventure-travel company, and spent years teaching young people to paddle. His career is distinguished by craft, commitment, and the simple love of being on the water. Over time, the miles on the water shaped him, and they helped him understand the sport in a way few others do.

His perspective deepened through personal tragedy while writing his graduate thesis, The Lived Experiences of Whitewater Kayakers, a four-year exploration of how paddlers form meaning, identity, and community on the water. Brett completed much of this work while grieving the loss of his closest friend on the Grand Canyon — a period that strengthened his dedication to safety, storytelling, and honoring the river community.

Today, Brett serves as Policy Director for the American Canoe Association, where he works on national access, public lands protections, paddlesports safety, and grassroots engagement. He has spent more than a decade collaborating with the Outdoor Alliance, advocating on Capitol Hill, and working with paddlers across the country to protect the places we love. He recently co-authored Smart Start, a modern introduction to paddling designed to welcome new participants and broaden access to the sport.

Across all these roles — educator, guide, athlete, researcher, writer, and policy leader — Brett has shaped a holistic career in paddlesports. Following Waters is his way of giving that back to the community: creating access through storytelling, honoring the people and ideas that sustain paddlesports, and opening a world of wonder for listeners the same way it was opened for...

In this episode, Brett sits down with Brad Burden, whose whitewater story spans early passion, professional intensity, a two-decade hiatus, and an unexpected return that has brought new meaning, joy, and connection to the second half of life.

Brad opens up about his formative days paddling at the NOC, his early rise as a professional kayaker, and the four-year push that culminated in a near-miss incident on the Slave River—a moment that signaled a deeper emotional and mental exhaustion. What followed was a conscious step away from whitewater and eventually a full transition into a stable and grounded life as a high school teacher, basketball coach, husband, and father.

Twenty years later, another shift in Brad’s professional life became the catalyst to rediscover a piece of himself he’d set aside. With humility and curiosity, he stepped back into the whitewater world—beginning with a return to the Gauley, where a swim on Lost Paddle reminded him both of who he used to be and who he is now.

Brad shares how the next generation of paddlers welcomed him in with open arms, how community has shaped this re-entry, and why he feels compelled now to contribute, mentor, and reconnect through his new show, B Flow Sessions, a podcast dedicated to stories and people who shaped his life on the river.

This is a reflective, inspiring episode about going hard, evolving identity, renewal, belonging, and the ways rivers have a way of calling us back.

1. Brad’s early years at the NOC and journey into professional kayaking
2. The emotional toll and burnout that followed a hard four-year push
3. The near-accident on the Slave River that changed everything
4. Why Brad stepped away from whitewater for 20 years
5. Building a new life: teaching, coaching, marriage, and family
6. The moment he realized he wanted to return
7. Coming back to the Gauley — and swimming Lost Paddle after two decades off the river
8. The generosity and welcoming spirit of the new generation of paddlers
9. The creation of B Flow Sessions and Brad’s desire to give back
10. How adventure, community, and self-understanding evolve in mid-life

Brad Burden is a former professional kayaker, educator, coach, and storyteller whose decades-spanning relationship with whitewater has taken many shapes. After an intense period of professional paddling in the early 2000s, Brad stepped away from the sport for 20 years to build a career in teaching and basketball coaching, while focusing on family and personal growth. Recently, a major life transition brought him back to rivers with fresh perspective and renewed joy. Brad now hosts B Flow Sessions, a podcast exploring the people and stories who shaped his paddling journey and continue to inspire his return to the whitewater community.

In this episode of Following Waters, Brett sits down with Jed Hinkley — Olympian, multi-discipline athlete, and national sport administrator — for a conversation that bridges personal journey with the future of competitive paddle sports in the United States.

Jed reflects on his athletic beginnings as a six-year-old alpine racer, his transition to Nordic combined by age twelve, and his rise to represent the United States in the 2002 Winter Olympics. He shares memories from World Junior Championships, insights from years of elite athletic development, and the lessons he carried into his later work supporting sport pathways at USA Nordic and now at the American Canoe Association.

Together, Brett and Jed explore the challenges and opportunities in building a stronger pipeline for young paddlers. They discuss infrastructure needs, coaching development, the vital role of community-based programs, and the often-overlooked connection between recreational paddling and competitive pathways. Jed also highlights the huge — and largely untapped — potential within summer camps as entry points for developing future athletes.

This episode offers a thoughtful, forward-looking perspective on how to grow the sport’s competitive base while honoring the joy and culture of paddling that draw people to the water in the first place.

• Jed’s early athletic life and transition through multiple winter sports
• His journey to becoming a 2002 Olympian in Nordic combined
• Lessons from coaching, development, and sport administration
• How USA Nordic shaped his understanding of athlete pipelines
• His current role at the American Canoe Association
• Why competitive paddling in the U.S. faces unique challenges
• The opportunity to build stronger youth pathways and coaching systems
• Bridging rec-focused paddling communities with competitive programs
• The overlooked potential of summer camps as talent incubators
• What a sustainable, intentional future for U.S. paddlesports could look like

Jed Hinkley is an Olympian, coach, and sport development leader whose career spans elite athletic performance and national-level program building. After competing in the 2002 Winter Olympics in Nordic combined, Jed moved into coaching and sport administration, supporting youth development, national pipelines, and high-performance structures at USA Nordic before transitioning to the American Canoe Association. His work focuses on strengthening competitive pathways, expanding access, and building systems that help young athletes thrive.

Drop Jed a line at: jhinkley@americancanoe.org

Drop me a line at: bmayer@americancanoe.org

Brett Mayer is the host of Following Waters, a storytelling platform sponsored by the American Canoe Association that explores education, stewardship, adventure, and competition across the paddlesports world. His work blends two decades of river experience with a lifelong commitment to environmental education, access, and community.

Brett’s connection to water began long before he picked up a paddle — growing up outdoors, studying environmental science and policy, and developing a deep interest in the ways people form bonds with place. After a Division I soccer career, he transitioned fully into the natural world, finding in paddling a profound sense of connection and purpose.

In 2003, Brett began kayaking, eventually becoming a sponsored paddler working with several outdoor brands, traveling widely, and competing in a range of races. He later became an ACA Level IV whitewater...

In this episode of Following Waters, host Brett Mayer sits down with longtime paddler, competitor, educator, and conservation entrepreneur Sam Drevo. From his early beginnings in Maryland at Valley Mill Camp to winning the Gorge Games, founding eNRG Kayaking, teaching thousands of new paddlers, and helping steward Rios Lodge on Costa Rica’s Pacuare River, Sam’s life has been defined by rivers in every way imaginable.

We explore the arc of his whitewater journey—competition, teaching, guiding, business-building, river cleanups, stewardship, loss, resilience, and what it means to dedicate a life to paddlesports and the health of the places we love.

• The river moments that shaped him most
• What it felt like to build a paddlesports business from the ground up
• How competition informed his approach to teaching and safety
• Why he believes paddlers have a unique responsibility to steward their rivers
• How the 2020 wildfires changed his life, his priorities, and his work
• What makes Rios Lodge a model for eco-tourism and cultural conservation
• His advice for the next generation of paddlers, guides, and river leaders

Sam Drevo is a veteran whitewater athlete, ACA instructor trainer, Rescue 3 educator, river conservationist, and founder of eNRG Kayaking, one of the most widely recognized paddlesports schools in the Pacific Northwest. He competes, coaches, teaches, and advocates for rivers globally, and is part of the stewardship team behind Rios Lodge on Costa Rica’s Pacuare River—continuing the conservation-first legacy of the late Rafael Gallo. Sam also serves on the board of We Love Clean Rivers, a nonprofit transforming recreation into river restoration through community cleanups and watershed partnerships.

• eNRG Kayaking
• Rios Lodge (Pacuare River)
• We Love Clean Rivers
• ACA Instructor & Education Programs

Brett Mayer is the Policy Director for the American Canoe Association and host of Following Waters. His work spans paddlesports education, environmental stewardship, access advocacy, and community storytelling, drawing from two decades of experience as an educator, researcher, ACA instructor, sponsored paddler, and public lands advocate.

If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to Following Waters on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. New episodes celebrate the voices shaping paddlesports, stewardship, adventure, and community.

Mentioned in this episode:

JointheACA

JointheACA

In this episode of Following Waters, host Brett Mayer sits down with Buffy Burge — a pioneering whitewater kayaker, five-time Gore Canyon Champion, and the 2003 Green Race winner — whose story is equal parts adventure and reflection.

From her early days discovering rivers at summer camp, to the bold expeditions that defined her twenties — including the Middle Kings, the Waitaha Gorge, and remote runs in Bhutan — Buffy helped open doors for women in the whitewater world.

Then, life shifted. Motherhood, family, and time away from the sport gave her a new relationship to risk and identity. Twenty years later, she returned — not to reclaim old glory, but to share the experience with her teenage son as they became the first mother-son duo to race the Green Narrows together.

1. How Buffy first found whitewater and what drew her into Class V terrain
2. Lessons from pioneering all-female expeditions in the early 2000s
3. Why stepping away from the river changed her perspective on performance
4. What the river teaches about flow, identity, and belonging

Buffy Burge is a whitewater kayaker, extreme racer, and mother of three living in Fletcher, NC. A five-time Gore Canyon champion and 2003 Green Race winner, she’s paddled in over ten countries and helped lead early all-female expeditions in New Zealand and Bhutan. After two decades away from competition, she returned in 2023 to race the Green River Narrows alongside her teenage son — reminding us all that courage and curiosity don’t have an age limit.

1. Green River Access Fund
2. Anna Levesque podcast interview with Buffy Burge
3. Green Race - Official Site
4. American Canoe Association

Today’s guest is Lisa Raleigh, Executive Director of RiverLink, a nonprofit based in Asheville that champions the health, accessibility, and resilience of the French Broad River and its watershed.

A trained geologist and hydrologist with a PhD in Environmental Science from the University of Oklahoma, Lisa’s path has wound through nonprofit advancement, outdoor industry communications, and community leadership. Since arriving at RiverLink in 2021, she has guided the organization through major milestones — from the opening of Karen Cragnolin Park to the evolving role RiverLink now plays in post-Hurricane Helene recovery efforts.

In this conversation, Lisa and host Brett Mayer explore the intersections of science, story, and stewardship: how rivers shape community identity, how resilience is being redefined in a changing climate, and how each of us can help create healthier waterways.

1. Lisa’s early experiences in Montana and the path that led her to study geology and hydrology
2. Lessons learned from decades in nonprofit leadership and community engagement
3. The opening of Karen Cragnolin Park as a symbol of restoration and access along the French Broad
4. How Hurricane Helene revealed both vulnerabilities and collective strength across Western North Carolina
5. The evolving concept of “making room for rivers” in the age of climate change
6. Finding personal balance, hope, and renewal in the work of resilience

Lisa is a scientist, fundraiser, and outdoor enthusiast who brings a lifelong love of nature and a deep commitment to environmental and social justice to her leadership at RiverLink. Before joining the organization, she spent more than a decade as the Director of Advancement at Colorado Rocky Mountain School, co-founded Backbone Media, and worked as a nonprofit fundraising consultant.

A Montana native who lived in Colorado for 30 years before relocating to Asheville, Lisa is also a trail runner, climber, road biker, and proud mother of two daughters, Sunni and Belle.

1. RiverLink
2. Blue Ridge Public Radio – Cleaning Up the French Broad after Helene
3. Edible Asheville – A Force of Nature: A Conversation with Lisa Raleigh