In this episode of Swimming Upstream, host Tom Luna sits down in New Orleans at the Excel in Education Conference with Senator Lori Den Hartog, Senate Majority Leader from Idaho, to explore how education policy, school choice, and government accountability intersect especially in a fast-growing state.

Sen. Den Hartog shares her personal story growing up on a dairy farm in rural Ada County and how that upbringing shaped her work ethic and her views on private property rights, regulation, and the real-world cost of government bureaucracy especially for small businesses and family operations.

The conversation then turns to education policy, where Den Hartog emphasizes the importance of transparency, especially since K–12 education represents a major portion of Idaho’s state budget. She explains why unclear funding flows make it difficult to track spending, measure outcomes, and defend policies ultimately limiting the state’s ability to evaluate what’s working.

Finally, Den Hartog explains the broader challenge legislators face: balancing education investments alongside transportation, healthcare, corrections, and other core state responsibilities while remembering that every dollar is taxpayer money.

Key Moments

00:00 Tom Luna intro + the “not rocket science… more complicated” line

00:41 Live from New Orleans: introducing Sen. Lori Den Hartog

02:58 Growing up on a dairy farm + how it shaped her leadership

07:43 Growth, regulation, and why “time is money” for small businesses

10:46 Why education funding needs transparency and traceable results

13:06 Why school choice has always felt “normal” to her

16:41 Idaho’s refundable education tax credit: who qualifies + what it covers

22:07 Balancing education with roads, healthcare, and other state priorities

Connect with Lori Den Hartog

Website: https://www.dordt.edu/